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PostPosted: 25 Jun 2021, 11:31 
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24 June 2021: BBC News
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HMS Defender: Russian jets and ships shadow British warship

More than 20 Russian aircraft and two coastguard ships have shadowed a British warship sailing near Crimea.

Moscow's defence ministry said a patrol ship fired warning shots and a jet dropped bombs in the path of HMS Defender as it sailed some 12 miles (19km) off Crimea's coast.

The UK government rejected Russia's account of the incident and denied that any warning shots had been fired.

A BBC correspondent on the warship said it was harassed by Russia's military.

Aircraft could be heard overhead as BBC defence correspondent Jonathan Beale filed a report from the deck of HMS Defender in the Black Sea as it sailed to Georgia. He described hostile warnings over the radio as the warship's crew prepared for a possible confrontation.

What will be the fallout from the Black Sea incident?
Our correspondent, who had been invited on board the ship before the incident happened, saw more than 20 aircraft overhead and two Russian coastguard boats which at times were just 100m (328ft) away.

This is at odds with statements from both the British prime minister's office and defence ministry, which denied any confrontation.

HMS Defender was sailing from Odessa in southern Ukraine to Georgia. To get there, it passed south of the Crimea peninsula, which Russia annexed from Ukraine in 2014 in a move that has not been recognised internationally.

While Moscow claims the peninsula and its waters are Russian territory, the UK says HMS Defender was passing through Ukrainian waters in a commonly used and internationally recognised transit route.

A source told BBC diplomatic correspondent James Landale that the Defender was not there to pick a fight but to make a point - to assert its right to freedom of navigation in international waters.

Russia's defence ministry said the "dangerous actions" of the navy ship entering its waters were a "gross violation" of the UN Convention's sea laws, and called for the crew to be investigated.

A later tweet from the Russian embassy in the UK said: "HMS Defender turns HMS Provocateur and violates Russian border. Not exactly a 'routine' transit, is it?"

But a UK government spokesman played down any notion of hostilities, insisting that Russia was doing "gunnery exercises" in the Black Sea.

UK Defence Secretary Ben Wallace added: "As is routine, Russian vessels shadowed [the ship's] passage and she was made aware of training exercises in her wider vicinity."

The British ambassador was summoned to the Russian foreign ministry in Moscow, and met officials on Wednesday afternoon.



Quote:
On board HMS Defender
Jonathan Beale, Defence Correspondent

I am on board the warship in the Black Sea.

The crew were already at action stations as they approached the southern tip of Russian-occupied Crimea. Weapons systems on board the Royal Navy destroyer had already been loaded.

This would be a deliberate move to make a point to Russia. HMS Defender was going to sail within the 12 mile (19km) limit of Crimea's territorial waters. The captain insisted he was only seeking safe passage through an internationally recognised shipping lane.

Two Russian coastguard ships that were shadowing the Royal Navy warship, tried to force it to alter its course. At one stage, one of the Russian vessels closed in to about 100m.

Increasingly hostile warnings were issued over the radio - including one that said "if you don't change course I'll fire". We did hear some firing in the distance but they were believed to be well out of range.

As HMS Defender sailed through the shipping lane it was buzzed by Russian jets. The Captain, Vincent Owen, said the ship detected more than 20 military aircraft nearby. Commander Owen said his mission was confident but non-confrontational.

Russia said the incident happened just after midday local time (09:00 GMT) in the Black Sea near Cape Fiolent in the south of Crimea.

According to the Russian military, HMS Defender was told to change course, and when it failed to do so, a Russian border patrol ship sent several warning shots. About ten minutes later, a military jet dropped warning bombs in the path of the destroyer.

This case is reminiscent of a similar incident in November 2020, when Russia accused a US warship of travelling 2km into its waters in the Sea of Japan.

Russia's defence ministry said it had warned the USS John S McCain that it would be rammed if it continued sailing in the territorial waters, before chasing off the warship. However the US Navy said those claims were false, and that its ship had not been "expelled" from the area.

HMS Defender is a Type 45 destroyer that is part of the UK's Carrier Strike Group. It is carrying out missions in the Black Sea, according to the Royal Navy's website.

The warship was in the southern Ukrainian port of Odessa earlier this week, according to the British embassy in Ukraine. It said the UK and Ukraine had signed an agreement to jointly build warships and construct two naval bases.

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PostPosted: 25 Jun 2021, 11:33 
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A video released by Russia's defence ministry allegedly shows HMS Defender from a Russian aircraft
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PostPosted: 25 Jun 2021, 12:33 
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Dean wrote:
24 June 2021: BBC News
Quote:
[b]
The UK government rejected Russia's account of the incident and denied that any warning shots had been fired.

Hmmm, a little difficult to believe after the footage released by the Russian Coast Guard yesterday:


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PostPosted: 25 Jun 2021, 13:35 
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Thanks Mfezi!

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But a UK government spokesman played down any notion of hostilities, insisting that Russia was doing "gunnery exercises" in the Black Sea.
:lol:

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PostPosted: 25 Jun 2021, 21:58 
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I did wonder who was going to broach this event.

Here's the rub:-
- the Black Sea is not Russian territorial waters.
- UNCLOS is the arbiter, Russia is a signatory.

Putin and Co are playing their usual little games, the Royal Navy is quite used to it. The multi-national NATO (and non-Nato) maritime exercise 'Sea Breeze 2021' starts soon, in the Black Sea, whether Vlad likes it or not.

And that's it - simple!

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PostPosted: 26 Jun 2021, 18:25 
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Tally-ho wrote:
Here's the rub:-
- the Black Sea is not Russian territorial waters.
- UNCLOS is the arbiter, Russia is a signatory.


Hi Tally-Ho. In your first point, did you perhaps mean to write: "that particular part of the Black Sea is not Russian territorial waters"? even if you ignore the Crimean claim by the Russians, large parts of the Black Sea is indeed Russian territorial waters and that is not in dispute. Russia has undisputed shoreline along the Black Sea coast from the Taman Peninsula all the way down to the border with Georgia and no one is claiming that those waters are not Russian territorial waters. The entire Eastern shore of the Sea of Azov is also Russian territorial waters.

This dispute is specifically about the waters off the Crimean coast. Since Russia considers Crimea now fully re-united with Russia and therefore Russian territory, they also automatically claim the 12 nm off the coast of Crimea as their territorial waters along with it. Since the UK along with most other countries, including all NATO countries, consider Crimea as occupied Ukrainian territory, they also consider the waters off the coast of Crimea as Ukrainian territorial waters. It is not really a UNCLOS issue, but rather a de jure vs de facto issue about who Crimea belongs to.

This event is also further complicated by the fact that whether or not those waters are Russian territorial waters, the British ship was claiming innocent passage. It is a bit of an issue for the British ship, because by claiming innocent passage (as it clearly did over the radio communications), it was actually admitting that it was entering Russian territorial waters. The Russians could probably now claim that the Royal Navy admitted those waters are Russian, otherwise they wouldn't have claimed innocent passage, but the British ship would probably just say they reacted based on the temporary de facto situation. Regardless of the little potential faux pas, the events that followed were as a result of the Russian Coast Guard rejecting the RN claim of innocent passage.

As a bit of further context, part II of UNCLOS, Article 19 states:
1. Passage is innocent so long as it is not prejudicial to the peace, good order or security of the coastal State. Such passage shall take place in conformity with this Convention and with other rules of international law.
2. Passage of a foreign ship shall be considered to be prejudicial to the peace, good order or security of the coastal State if in the territorial sea it engages in any of the following activities:
(a) any threat or use of force against the sovereignty, territorial integrity or political independence of the coastal State, or in any other manner in violation of the principles of international law embodied in the Charter of the United Nations;
(b) any exercise or practice with weapons of any kind;
(c) any act aimed at collecting information to the prejudice of the defence or security of the coastal State;
(d) any act of propaganda aimed at affecting the defence or security of the coastal State;
(e) the launching, landing or taking on board of any aircraft;
(f) the launching, landing or taking on board of any military device;
(g) the loading or unloading of any commodity, currency or person contrary to the customs, fiscal, immigration or sanitary laws and regulations of the coastal State;
(h) any act of wilful and serious pollution contrary to this Convention;
(i) any fishing activities;
(j) the carrying out of research or survey activities;
(k) any act aimed at interfering with any systems of communication or any other facilities or installations of the coastal State;
(l) any other activity not having a direct bearing on passage.


The Russian coast guard ship stated that the British ship "broke the rules of innocent passage", but they didn't state specifically which one (or more) of the ones listed above it considered broken. Some of them leave quite a lot open to interpretation. I highly doubt this event would go to any kind of arbitration or court though. In the end, I guess both sides will be claiming the other was "playing their usual little games" :wink:


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PostPosted: 27 Jun 2021, 11:06 
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Greetings and salutations Mfezi! :)

Yes, of course Russia has territorial waters in parts of the Black Sea. However, the posturing and bully-boy shenanigans whenever a foreign naval vessel sails through the Bosphorus Straits into the Black Sea, gives the impression that Russia thinks it has sole rights on its usage. The stiffening response to this bully-boy attitude is already evident – reference ‘Sea Breeze 2021’ the upcoming multi-national naval exercise.
The Royal Navy too is increasing its footprint in the Black Sea – not to mention the Ukrainian Navy acquiring British built naval vessels, possibly even Type 31 frigates. The Kremlin will be choking on their Borscht!

I will not venture into the politics of the 'de jure' and 'de facto' argument pertaining to Crimean ‘ownership’ …

“Innocent passage”
UNCLOS is there for a purpose, Russia is a signatory and is therefor bound by the agreement’s content. Russia (Putin & Co) needs to understand and respect the ‘rules based’ world we all live in.
Russian Border Force gunboat shenanigans, as seen in the past week, is a nonsense. HMS Defender proved the point by sailing on undeterred and unimpressed, to her next Black Sea port of call in Georgia.
As you say, and I concur, probably nothing further will come of this particular incident. The Royal Navy and passage of the world’s oceans and seas have a centuries long symbiotic relationship – long may it continue.

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PostPosted: 27 Jun 2021, 13:10 
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Interesting follow-on development. Seems the whole event was very deliberate and carefully planned from the UK side:

Classified Ministry of Defence documents found at bus stop
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-57624942

By Paul Adams
Diplomatic correspondent

One set of documents discusses the likely Russian reaction to the ship's passage through Ukrainian waters off the Crimea coast on Wednesday. Another details plans for a possible UK military presence in Afghanistan after the US-led Nato operation there ends.
The government said an investigation had been launched. A Ministry of Defence spokesperson said an employee had reported the loss of sensitive defence papers, adding: "It would be inappropriate to comment further." The documents, almost 50 pages in all, were found in a soggy heap behind a bus stop in Kent early on Tuesday morning.

A member of the public, who wishes to remain anonymous, contacted the BBC when he realised the sensitive nature of the contents. The BBC believes the documents, which include emails and PowerPoint presentations, originated in the office of a senior official at the Ministry of Defence (MoD).

The documents relating to the Royal Navy's Type 45 destroyer, HMS Defender, show that a mission described by the MoD as an "innocent passage through Ukrainian territorial waters", with guns covered and the ship's helicopter stowed in its hangar, was conducted in the expectation that Russia might respond aggressively.

On Wednesday more than 20 Russian aircraft and two coastguard ships shadowed the warship as it sailed about 12 miles (19km) off Crimea's coast. Moscow's defence ministry said a patrol ship fired warning shots and a jet dropped bombs in the destroyer's path but the UK government rejected this account, denying any warning shots had been fired.

The mission, dubbed "Op Ditroite", was the subject of high-level discussions as late as Monday, the documents show, with officials speculating about Russia's reaction if HMS Defender sailed close to Crimea.

"What do we understand about the possible 'welcome party'…?" asked an official at Permanent Joint Headquarters (PJHQ), the UK's tri-service headquarters at Northwood.
Recent interactions in the eastern Mediterranean between Russian forces and a Carrier Strike Group led by HMS Queen Elizabeth had been unremarkable and "in line with expectations", the document said.
But officials knew this was about to change.
"Following the transition from defence engagement activity to operational activity, it is highly likely that RFN (Russian navy) and VKS (Russian air force) interactions will become more frequent and assertive," one presentation warned.

A series of slides prepared at PJHQ shows two routeing options, one described as "a safe and professional direct transit from Odessa to Batumi", including a short stretch through a "Traffic Separation Scheme" (TSS) close to the south-west tip of Crimea.
This route, one slide concluded, would "provide an opportunity to engage with the Ukrainian government… in what the UK recognises as Ukrainian territorial waters."
Three potential Russian responses were outlined, from "safe and professional" to "neither safe nor professional".
In the event, Russia chose to react aggressively, with radio warnings, coastguard vessels closing to within 100 metres and repeated buzzing by warplanes.
An alternative route was considered, which would have kept HMS Defender well away from contested waters.
This would have avoided confrontation, the presentation noted, but ran the risk of being portrayed by Russia as evidence of "the UK being scared/running away", allowing Russia to claim that the UK had belatedly accepted Moscow's claim to Crimean territorial waters.

"As the public would expect, the Ministry of Defence plans carefully," an MoD spokesperson said.
"As a matter of routine, that includes analysing all the potential factors affecting operational decisions."
Alongside the military planning, officials anticipated competing versions of events.
"We have a strong, legitimate narrative", they said, noting that the presence of the embedded journalists (from the BBC and Daily Mail) on board the destroyer "provides an option for independent verification of HMS Defender's action".

Following the controversy generated by HMS Defender's mission, the documents discovered in Kent confirm that passage through the TSS was a calculated decision by the British government to make a show of support for Ukraine, despite the possible risks involved.

Was this gunboat diplomacy?
It was certainly the use of a warship in pursuit of diplomatic goals. But its primary objective was not to "poke the Russian bear" (a phrase and sentiment conspicuously absent from the documents). This was all about freedom of navigation and a clear endorsement of Ukraine's sovereignty, following Russia's annexation of Crimea in 2014.
Under the terms of the 1982 UN Convention on the Law of the Sea, the passage of a foreign ship is regarded as "innocent" when "it is not prejudicial to the peace, good order, or security of the coastal state."
In the eyes of much of the world, that state is Ukraine, not Russia.

The documents don't stop there.
The bundle includes updates on arms exports campaigns, including sensitive observations about areas where Britain might find itself competing with European allies.
There's a whiff of post-Brexit anxiety in comments attributed to "SofS" (Defence Secretary Ben Wallace), who insists that the six-member European Organisation for Joint Armament Cooperation (OCCAR), of which Britain is a member, "must not be hijacked" by "entryism" from the European Commission.
And there are briefing notes for last Monday's session of the UK-US Defence Dialogue, including observations on President Joe Biden's first months in office.
The Biden administration's early focus on China and the Indo-Pacific, they say, show "there is still much continuity from the previous administration."
There are also suggestions of what Britain should be asking for.

"We should use the meeting to see how much the administration is prepared to share, or whether its stated ambition of consulting more with allies is truer in principle than in practice."

Sensitive military recommendations
Most of the papers are marked "official sensitive", a relatively low level of classification used, according to the government, "where there is a clear and justifiable requirement to reinforce the 'need to know'".
But one document, addressed to Ben Wallace's private secretary, and marked "Secret UK Eyes Only", outlines highly sensitive recommendations for the UK's military footprint in Afghanistan, following the end of Operation Resolute Support, the Nato operation currently winding down in the wake of President Biden's decision earlier this year to withdraw American forces.
The document discusses an American request for British assistance in several specific areas, and addresses the question of whether any British special forces will remain in Afghanistan once the withdrawal is complete.
Media reports have already suggested Britain is considering leaving some forces behind.

Due to the sensitivity of the document, the BBC has decided not to report details which could endanger the security of British and other personnel in Afghanistan.
But amid reports of a worsening security situation in the country, it sounds several warnings.
"Any UK footprint in Afghanistan that persists... is assessed to be vulnerable to targeting by a complex network of actors," it says, noting that "the option to withdraw completely remains."
Afghanistan, it says, is already becoming more dangerous.
The reduced presence of Nato forces "is already impairing the situational awareness that we (and the US) used to enjoy across the country".
No Britons have been killed in Afghanistan since the US-Taliban deal in February 2020, it says, but "this would be unlikely to remain the status quo".

Rarely has a collection of lost documents covered such a wide range of important areas. This is a major embarrassment for the Ministry of Defence, which is currently carrying out a detailed investigation into how the papers came to be lying on a street corner, in the rain, in the early hours of Tuesday morning.


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PostPosted: 27 Jun 2021, 13:35 
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Yes, I saw and read this story in this morning's press. Suffice to say the dark world resembling a John le Carré spy novel or a Agatha Christie thriller, seems alive and well.

A bus stop on a dark rainy night .... :shock: :D :?:

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PostPosted: 28 Jun 2021, 13:03 
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Disclaimer: - The following is merely an exercise in thinking broadly, slightly spiced.

The British are past masters at subterfuge, the ruse that is almost true, the setting of a honey trap, whereby the gullible are coaxed into the centre only to find they have been tricked.
The bus stop dossier regarding HMS Defender may have been a deliberate act, a ‘dark ops’ act to ensure that there is a theatrical Russian response to a British naval vessel legitimately sailing the seas. The British warship was even carrying media representatives from various news outlets, all their pictures and videos are readily available on the internet.
And what does it show? It shows the hoped-for theatrical shenanigans of the Russian military, of speeding Russian Coast Guard boats with bow wave in front and foaming wake behind, of Russian war planes screaming past igniting their afterburners for additional sound effects. On the Russian Coast Guard boat there are voices commanding HMS Defender to change course, warning of gunfire, all the bells and whistles of impending doom and disaster. The Russian media shows footage of the British warship framed by digital sights, it shows the pom-pom gun on the foredeck of the Coast Guard boat puffing away towards some little speck on the horizon. Live theatrics as the world looks on!

An old Arab proverb says – “The dogs bark but the caravan moves on”. HMS Defender sailed past the Crimea and visited Georgia (a former Soviet Republic) on the eastern shores of the Black Sea, by invitation as planned.

A dossier at a bus stop and a honey trap ….

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PostPosted: 29 Jun 2021, 10:57 
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A short video clip of what is reported to be the first encounter between a RAF F-35B Lightning based on HMS Queen Elizabeth and a Russian Navy frigate, Admiral Makarov, in the eastern Mediterranean. Credit unknown.

https://t.me/new_militarycolumnist/57876

The script underneath (Google translated) reads as follows:-
The first meeting of combat aircraft of the Russian Aerospace Forces and the F-35B of the Royal Navy of Great Britain took place in the air over the eastern part of the Mediterranean Sea. The passage of the fifth generation fighter was recorded from the board of the frigate "Admiral Makarov".

I do not know what the Russian officer on the bridge says about the sighting, as he communicates on the radio. Interesting to note the light weight tropical style uniform being worn - summer in the Med of course.

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PostPosted: 29 Jun 2021, 11:50 
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Tally-ho wrote:
A short video clip of what is reported to be the first encounter between a RAF F-35B Lightning based on HMS Queen Elizabeth and a Russian Navy frigate, Admiral Makarov, in the eastern Mediterranean. Credit unknown.


A lot more context here:
https://theaviationist.com/2021/06/28/f ... -ship-med/
And here:
https://apnews.com/article/middle-east- ... 98f6f108a3

By the way, the commentary in the background of your video clip (which was taken from a NTV news report) is about the MiG-31K's that are participating in the same exercise, and the fact that these aircraft carry the Kinzhal hypersonic missile. The participating MiG-31K's were recently deployed to Syria, which is a first for them. More on their deployment here:
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/4 ... s-in-syria


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PostPosted: 29 Jun 2021, 12:30 
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So if I understand you correctly, the officer's voice is not describing the flypast of an F-35? He is in fact talking about the MiG-31K deployment to Syria?

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PostPosted: 29 Jun 2021, 14:33 
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Tally-ho wrote:
So if I understand you correctly, the officer's voice is not describing the flypast of an F-35? He is in fact talking about the MiG-31K deployment to Syria?

It is not the officer talking (at least not in the clip that you linked to). It is the news narrator from the NTV Сегодня (Today) show. In fact, I was able to find the original report, it was the 08:00 news from Yesterday morning. The final report was "Перехватили в воздухе: российские летчики и моряки провели совместные учения в Средиземном море." or "Intercepted in the air: Russian pilots and sailors conducted joint exercises in the Mediterranean". The report starts at 16:59 in the video below. The specific part shown in the link that you posted starts at 18:35.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ivuqb63LVEg&t=1019s
[I think NTV doesn't allow direct links to their videos - so you will have to click on the link above to watch it directly on YouTube]

The entire news clip doesn't mention the F-35 at all - it just shows the footage briefly. At one point it mentioned something like "...and by the way, the RN Aircraft Carrier Queen Elizabeth and a RN submarine along with various escort ships have also been operating off the coast of Cyprus since the beginning of June...". However, besides that one mention, it seems to be simply a report about a typical military exercise. It once mentions a "hypothetical enemy", but not anyone specific. In the brief interview with the officer he does mention how they monitor the air situation and potential air targets as part of the exercise, after which the editor apparently decided it would be a good place to splice in the footage of the F-35 while the discussion of the MiG-31 continues. Everything else in the report deals with the exercise itself; a lot about the fact that the MiG-31K's equipped with Kinzhal missiles are operating from Syria for the first time along with the Tu-22M3's that are also based there now; and how the Navy and Air Force operate jointly. No mention of the F-35 - just the brief video footage.


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PostPosted: 29 Jun 2021, 15:05 
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Thank you for clearing up my questions on the video clip.

It was important for me to understand the relationship between the voice, a man on a ship's bridge seemingly talking into a microphone and then the script underneath the video link. Clearly, they are unrelated, you mention "apparent splicing".

Narrative warfare has become a fashionable tool / weapon in distributing information, sometimes even plain old bs ... :) :wink: ... no not implying you.

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