The SAAF Forum

Somehow I got into a Spitfire mood this weekend ...



41 Squadron operated four of these natural metal Spitfires. (MH931 + MH993) (MA504 + MA792) They were stripped of all excess weight, the engine was modified & they then operated in pairs. This to intercept high flying Luftwaffe Ju-86P's at +40,000ft. The idea being that one aircraft (armed only with machine guns) would climb to the altitude of the Ju-86, and force it down to the level of the second aircraft, which was armed with cannons.

Cheers

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Brent Best

Wow, Kremlin Such a beautiful piece of machinery.

This gave me a bit of an idea. Going to see if I can get some reference, and will make a P-51 Mustang. One SAAF and the other Mustang Sally I think. I've been experimenting a lot with shine and reflection.

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Gerard Griessel
http://www.wild-sky.co.za

Excellent job.

From two sources one being the book, Squadrons of the SAAF have the lighter cannon armed went up high and forced the Ju 86 down by damaging it, to the heavier machine gun armed aircraft which would then theoretically dispatch it.

The RAF used Mk V's for this and made some claims, but not one claim stands up.

Quote from the Axis Forum.

I have to correct this perpetuation of a myth. I suspect you are quoting from Spitfire Mark V Aces 1941-45, By Alfred Price ( pages 63-66 )?

P/O Gold and F/O Reynolds both claimed hits against Ju-86P but in each instance German records show no corresponding losses and no damage. In one instance for example F/O Reynolds claimed to intercept a Ju-86P at 49,000 feet.

Firstly this exceeds the service ceiling of a Ju-86P (c.40,000ft) and secondly the Spitfire VB which Reynolds flew only had a boosted 1190hp Merlin 46 engine. At best with a 1440hp Merlin 45 the mark V could manage 37,000 feet. Even the penultimate Spitfire altitude warrior Mark XIV with a 2,035hp Griffon 65/66 could only manage 43,000 feet so Reynold's claims of a kill at 49,000 feet had more to do with lack of oxygen to the brain.

It has however perpetuated a myth that the Mark VC Spitfire had a ceiling of 50,000ft, when more powerful Spits couldn't manage this.

As for the Ju-86P trailing smoke there is a German explanation of this. 29 Aug Ju-86P (Werk Nr.5144) of 2(F)/123 made a reconnaissanse flight to photograph the three harbors of the Suezcanal. Whilst returning about 150 km north of Alexandria in Egypt one engine failed at an altitude of 10500 (35,000ft) to 11000 metres (37,000ft). The pilot Hauptmann Helmut Rammig and observer Leutnant Kolw report they saw a Spitfire about 1000-2000 metres beneath them, but saw no gunfire. they assumed the Spitfire had a technical problem. The Ju-86P rapidly lost height and had to be ditched in the Mediterranean about 100 km south of Crete. A Do-24 of Seenotstaffel 7 responded with probably Leutnant Philipp Barbinger at the controls and the Ju-86P crew were flown to Suda Bay.

There is not one single confirmed Ju-86P high altitude kill over Egypt that stands up to examination.

That is why the He-177's sibling the He-277, or even had it been finished the He-274 would have been invulnerable over the UK.

Dunno how I missed this thread...

But my grandfather flew in 9Sqn SAAF... and flew the IX SHFs... that they used.

I have some pics of the pair of Spits at Idku (I think) of MH946. They were shared by 9 and 10 Sqns... my grandfather was then seconded to 145 RAF for the rest of the war.

Im planning on building my ICM IX kit as one of them. I just need to call up the old man and find out which one he flew.. and what wing type it had (methinks it would have originally been a C type).

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When in doubt, use a hammer. The bigger the doubt, the bigger the hammer.

That's neat

Get the serial# he flew & I'll send you a large .jpg.

Cheers

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Brent Best

I've always wanted to do something with a star on it ...



Cheers

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Brent Best

Dingo and I can suggest another "star"

Ok, here's another star for the two of you.



Cheers

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Brent Best

Spitfire LF.MK.IX of 40 Squadron.

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Brent Best

Spitfire LF Mk.IX from N° 4 Squadron.

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Brent Best

Anybody know what badge N° 7 squadron had during WWII ?

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Brent Best

Spitfire access door - just need to add the crowbar ...



Cheers

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Brent Best

Inspired by Monique's painting, I just had to do WR-RR, the aircraft flown by Lt-Col Rogers.



Cheers

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Brent Best

Brent, apart from the fact that your magnificent artwork makes me clean , and the hours of research you put in, I note the rudder shape is somewhat different between LF Mk. IX WR-RR and your previous Mk.IX?