The SAAF Forum

It has a Diverterless Supersonic Intake, and it is the first model. A basic comparison with the first prototype and the latest models show greater LERX, a DSI, along with other changes. This was rapid progress indeed.

It will be interesting to see how this jet developes during it's operational period.

I think it is a canny and clever project, as all those Mig21's/F-7's/F-5's will need replacing.

I do not think it can currently match the Gripen, but would keep an open mind over the lifespan of the design.

It interests me that Zimbabwe would want a fighter to "counter the South African Gripen": why? Did Mugabe envisage the possibility of armed conflict with South Africa?

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If thats the case. All I have to say to Mugabe is, bring it on beotch.

Steady now cowboy, war talk is cheap - much cheaper than the cost of war. What price would you for instance put on the life of a loved one? Rather talk sence in Mugaab's head while showing him the big stick than actually jumping the gun and using the big stick.

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Stay foolish; stay hungry

I think it is just a defensive stance ... ... I don't believe Zimbabwe ever TRIED to have offensive capabilities against SA. Even with the defensive capability, I don't think the idea or belief would be that they win, it would be just to bruise South Africa enough to conclude, "there is nothing north of limpopo worth the fight".

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In God I trust, everyone else bring your data!

Guess you're right; anyway who knows what passes through the space between Mugabe's ears?

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Aviate, navigate, communicate

Mugabe may act like a clown, but that is all it is ....... an ACT with him.

He is a very clever and ruthless person, and has numerous degrees obtained from South African and Rhodesian Uni's during white rule.

You under estimate him at your own risk, many have and have paid that ultimate price for doing just that. Look how fast he managed to gain control of his party after being released from prison.

He is a Stalinist and has never hiden that fact, just like Hitler people thought they could control him....Oops. His goal has been to remain in power and he has attained this goal succesfully. The cost for Zimbabwe though has been high, especially for those that are not Shona.

Never under estimate your foe, many have done so and lost during the course of history. Rather give your foe the benefit of doubt and plan accordingly.

I don't understand the purpose of this thread.

Gripen is superior JF-17 in all apsects.

performance.
LCC, maintaince
reliabiltiy
avionics
Sensors
weapon options
situation awareness
agility.

no sane person would ever choose JF-17 over Gripen.

just look at the record/history of SAAB, tunnan,lansen,draken,viggen.

guys you operate the worlds most net-centric modern singel engine light fighter that exist.

I disagree, but this is just a very rough example.

If a Gripen costs $60M, can carry six air-to-air missiles allowing it to down six enemy aircraft + four with the gun in a single sortie. That is a total of ten enemy aircraft per flight assuming everything works perfectly.

If a JF-17 or F-7 or whatever costs $5M twelve can be purchased for the price of one Gripen, so after the Gripen runs out of ammunition there are still two armed enemy aircraft per Gripen.

Obviously this does not take into account all the costs of a large fleet and I've assumed one-on-one engagements, the odds are not so good when you have a one vs many encounter.

For a practical example look at the SAAF vs Angola, I'm sure 26 Gripens can easily deal with their 18(?) Su-27, but 300 F-7s(for the same price) would have been a lot more impressive and would have been guaranteed to get the job done.

My apologies if this makes no sense, but it is early and I'm trying to avoid doing work:)

It's fine if you have the aircraft - but the problem is all the pilots are either working in OUR air force as instructors, or washing cars (as illegal immigrants) as it pays twice being a fighter pilot in Zim!
With their economy as it is, no one will sell anything to them in any case. And you forget, we have some Cheetahs in cotton wool and mothballs to take out should the need arise...

your apolobies are taken, because it doesnt make any sense what so ever

that such unrealistic senario, not even worth to take into acount,

countries who are/will operate JF-17/F-7 will not have afford to operate such a huge Numbers anyway.

my apologies if i sounded a bit harsh..

zeven you are a blessing to this forum. Thanks for joining and sharing. Now, on the PS-05/A radar. What is the range against a given radar cross section. I have seen a few different numbers and I believe people confuse maximum search, detection and track and also different RCSs.

Thanks

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In God I trust, everyone else bring your data!

Its impossible to say, becouse manufactors keep the RCS number classified, with all right. we dont even know gripens RCS. but here are some numbers. and information

Radar: Ericsson PS-05/A pulse doppler radar (can count anchored ships and follow road traffic at at least 90 km and detect typical fighter sized targets at 120 km).

Total mass 156 kg, antenna assembly 25 kg, antenna diameter 0.600 m,
Max power consumption 8.2 kW (114/200V 400Hz AC) and 250 kW 28V.

Predicted MTBF: 170 hours (air operation) Cooling air: 85g/s at 0oC, Cooling liquid: 3.5kW to be absored. Electrical interface: MIL-STD-1553B data bus and fibre optic video output to the display system.

Air to air scanning at 60 (at first 50) deg/s in either 2 120 deg bars, 2 60 deg bars or 4 30 deg bars. Surface mapping and search across 5 x 5 km to 40 x 40 km with GMTI speed adjustable by the pilot.

Four basic air to air modes: Track While Search, Priority Target Tracking gives higher quality tracking for multiple targets, Single Target Track gives highest quality data, Air Combat Mode for short range search and automatic target capture.

than add at least 30 percent here, because no one ever use their sensors full capability under peacetime.

radar (JAS-39): 20% longer than RDY (M2000-5), and 40% longer than the AN/APG-68 for F-16C/D Block40/42.

7. While combating with the basic type of MIG-29 (MIG-29G??) in BVR engagement:

* JAS-39A: the effective range for Gripen to detect MIG-29 is 60 km longer than the effective range for MIG-29 to detect Gripen.


* F-16C/D: the effective range for Falcon to detect MIG-29 is 5 km longer than the effective range for MIG-29 to detect Falcon.

ps.
now add 30 per cent. range. and then add TIDLS and you will have range + 25-30 per cent times 4 thanks to TIDLS and more powerfull processors

and you will have the best non AESA radar on the market.

btw, it was the first doppler radar as well. .

Thanks. I take it the 120km range floating around is near enough then. However, "fighter sized target"? ... ...
Is that 5 square metres or 3 square metres? What is the standard "fighter size"?

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In God I trust, everyone else bring your data!

when you talking about size you usally talk about wieght. and Gripen is half the size of EF and Rafale, and one third less than F-16.

Gripen have the smallest RCS "0.01." of all modern non stealth fighters today.
JSF ("golf ball sized") 0.005 m2 fighter x 0.18

F-117, B-2, F-22 0.0001 m2 fighter x 0.07

F-117, B-2 F-22 also given as 0.01-0.001 m2, ""marble sized or fighter x 0.12-0.21

F-22 RCS requirement was 1/1000th the F-15. This has probably be exceeded by a large margin. Even if the F-15 RCS is a large 25 m2, the F-22 is 0.025 m2 worst case (fighter x 0.26)."